Honda CB750 Sandcast
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Joe K on May 14, 2017, 10:08:49 pm
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Hello,
Can somebody who has the original 1969 complete tool kit please take a photo of it so I can see what is included? I think I have everything now but I just want to make sure. Also does anyone know what the file is supposed to be used for?
Thank you,
Joe K.
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It's a points file
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Joe, the best reference for tool kit is the parts book.
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Agreed, but worth noting that the driver handle should be red in colour, not black.
Chris R.
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Thank you, guys. Points file now makes sense. I will need to get a copy of the parts book so I can look it over. I will attach a photo in a few days that shows my set. I do have the red handle.
Joe K.
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Joe,
Here are two photos from an old 1969 CB750 Owners Manuel date 10-69 for your reference. Should answer your question on the number of items and correct tools included in the tool kit for the Sandcast bikes, not the best photos. As Chris stated, handle should be red. There are two different version (maybe more) of these handles with different Honda logos on them.
Best,
DW
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Thank you, DW. That parts list and photo of the tools will help me and anyone else looking for the complete tool kit. I did find on Ebay inexpensive file kit with a similar looking file and also tappet gauges. The file kit was $6 and the feeler gauges are $1.65. It's a good idea for anyone that doesn't have the complete tool kit but want something close. I have attached the links in case anyone is interested in doing the same. I noticed in the parts photo shows the file with a tiny hole in the top center. I wonder what that was for.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191269575570?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/191269575570?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/172633908840?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/172633908840?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
Joe K.
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I have the red handle but it wasn't in the kit. I'll swap it in there. Thanks for the info on the feelers and files. I'm watching so I won't lose them.
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you can also buy these items from other model CB models so in your search include the other models from 68 to 72
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Yes KP is right. I have found all of the original parts by looking at CB 350, 450, 550 & 750. I have even seen the original file, feeler gauges, new red screwdriver handle, etc. Not hard to do and can run a couple of hundred dollars because you will need to get a few tool kits to complete a correct Sandcast tool kit.
Joe K.
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For those interested and in need of, these listings have the original file (among other sandcast tools):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CL77-CB77-CB450-CL450-Tool-Kit-Bag-Tools-COMPLETE-/162413998344?hash=item25d0a0f108:g:FRAAAOSwax5Ytk-G&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/CL77-CB77-CB450-CL450-Tool-Kit-Bag-Tools-COMPLETE-/162413998344?hash=item25d0a0f108:g:FRAAAOSwax5Ytk-G&vxp=mtr)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-HONDA-CA-CB-CL-125-250-BENLY-DREAM-HM-TOOL-KIT-GOOD-USED-/292028552659?hash=item43fe4215d3:g:3WoAAOSwB-1Yo1Eb&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-HONDA-CA-CB-CL-125-250-BENLY-DREAM-HM-TOOL-KIT-GOOD-USED-/292028552659?hash=item43fe4215d3:g:3WoAAOSwB-1Yo1Eb&vxp=mtr)
This listing had the original feeler gauges (sold):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/89010-286-680-Tool-Set-Kit-CB350-CL350-SL350-Scrambler-350-1968-72-Honda-NOS-A13-/201927134435?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&nma=true&si=eZe%252BF0D6raBbzbxi271tWhohr%252FY%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc (http://www.ebay.com/itm/89010-286-680-Tool-Set-Kit-CB350-CL350-SL350-Scrambler-350-1968-72-Honda-NOS-A13-/201927134435?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&nma=true&si=eZe%252BF0D6raBbzbxi271tWhohr%252FY%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc)
Joe K.
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Was the correct sandcast shock wrench the flat stamped one or the cast one with the raised edge?
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Cast one is the shock wrench of choice for a Sandcast owner ;D
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Hello everyone,
Attached is a photo of my "sort of complete" sandcast tool kit. I can make it 100% complete but then I would need to spend about $300 to $400 purchasing a few tool kits to get the original tools I need.
The tools that are not original or correct using numbers from the Parts Book and shown by photos provided by DW69K0 in the thread above:
15. Thickness gauges. But I do have aftermarket .05mm & .08mm.
14. File. Aftermarket.
6. Spark plug wrench. Mine doesn't have the "checkering" grip at the end.
4. 8mm x 12mm open wrench. This is the new version without the Honda logo.
16. Tool bag. It looks like the photo on the parts list is a flat plastic bag. Mine is the padded version. I like my version but it very possibly is not correct.
Joe K.
13. Handle: for axle wrench. Mine is the correct length, but it came with another set and is not correct bend. I am going to use a vise to bend it more correctly and drill a hole. This is temporary until I can get the correct one.
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Attaching again. First time didn't work for some reason.
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By the way I soaked several of these tools in vinegar overnight and then scrubbed them with an S.O.S. pad. I would sometimes need to soak them two or three times more depending on how bad the tool was tarnished/stained to get them as clean as possible. Several of the tools have some of the zinc coating worn off so one day I will have them zinc plated again.
Joe K.
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Can anyone who has the correct tappet gauges and file measure them? I want to make sure I shorten my aftermarket ones to the correct length.
Thank you,
Joe K.
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Looking good Joe!
Does your tool pouch have the small pouch slot for the feeler gauges on the back side?
DW
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Hi DW,
Yes it does have the pouch slot in the back. That's one of the reasons I need to know the correct Honda length of the gauges so I can cut them to the correct size. Currently they are sticking out by about a half an inch.
Joe K.
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Joe- the feeler gauges are 85mm long.
Best,
DW
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Great. Thank you for letting me know about the length of the feeler gauges, DW. Can you also let me know how long the file is?
Joe K.
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This might be a dumb question because the parts manual shows the correct look of the spark plug wrench, but does anyone have an original tool kit with the longer spark plug wrench? I attached a photo for reference.
Thank you,
Joe K.
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What nobody going to respond. I'm sorry but I don't have access to my kits so cannot give you a 100% factual answer but I'm 99% sure the correct plug spanner is knurled as shown in the manual. I don't have a length for you but hopefully someone can provide this
Dementors
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Thank you, KP.
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Joe, the original bags were foam padded and said "HONDA" on them. the back side of bag had a little pocket to hold the valve clearance gauges.
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Hi Steve,
OK great. I have the original bag then. And it is in perfect shape.
Thank you,
Joe K.
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Joe,
The file I have measures 110mm, but I have a small chip on the end by the hole, so I hope others weigh in. I had to go through several kits to find one mostly intact. I do not have a pristine contact file. The tang and the file face potions are equal lengths between the heel.
DW
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Thanks again, DW. You're a big help.
Joe K.
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Joe,
The file I have measures 110mm, but I have a small chip on the end by the hole, so I hope others weigh in. I had to go through several kits to find one mostly intact. I do not have a pristine contact file. The tang and the file face potions are equal lengths between the heel.
DW
Duane, if/when you've a free moment, could you post a pic of the original file. i don't think i've seen an original file since 4779 was stolen August, 1971. Thanks in advance.
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Does anyone have any idea why there is a tiny hole in the top part of the file?
Joe K.
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Hello everyone,
Attached is a photo of my "sort of complete" sandcast tool kit. I can make it 100% complete but then I would need to spend about $300 to $400 purchasing a few tool kits to get the original tools I need.
The tools that are not original or correct using numbers from the Parts Book and shown by photos provided by DW69K0 in the thread above:
15. Thickness gauges. But I do have aftermarket .05mm & .08mm.
14. File. Aftermarket.
6. Spark plug wrench. Mine doesn't have the "checkering" grip at the end.
4. 8mm x 12mm open wrench. This is the new version without the Honda logo.
16. Tool bag. It looks like the photo on the parts list is a flat plastic bag. Mine is the padded version. I like my version but it very possibly is not correct.
Joe K.
13. Handle: for axle wrench. Mine is the correct length, but it came with another set and is not correct bend. I am going to use a vise to bend it more correctly and drill a hole. This is temporary until I can get the correct one.
Joe,
The other things I noticed that you did not mention.
- The handle for the axle wrench should be flat with a hole.
- KP responded, the correct spark plug wrench has knurled end.
Not being critical, but pointing out correct parts for your reference.
Best,DW
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Hi DW,
Yes thank you for bringing that up.
Joe K.
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This is not a complete kit but certainly shows the correct plug spanner, extension handle complete with hole and cast shock spanner.
Pliers (not shown) come in several variations, a long set and a short set. The longer pliers are correct for the sandcast kits whilst the shorter and more common are included in kits from about 72 onwards. The correct pliers are about the same length as the wheel nut spanner extension handle.
The CBX1000 spark plug tool looks very similar in appearance to the sandcast tool but the CBX is much longer.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1969-1970-Genuine-Honda-CB-750-SandCast-OEM-Tool-Kit-Set-Wrenches-Bag-USED-750-/322552232970?hash=item4b199c7c0a:g:kZ8AAOSwi8VZPsGQ (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1969-1970-Genuine-Honda-CB-750-SandCast-OEM-Tool-Kit-Set-Wrenches-Bag-USED-750-/322552232970?hash=item4b199c7c0a:g:kZ8AAOSwi8VZPsGQ)
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Good discussion. I assumed my sandcast kit was correct but to be honest I may have mixed them over the last few years. I'll recheck them and try some vinegar too.
I've had good luck on ebay searching CB Honda 750 wrench, Honda 750 tool kit, Honda tool kit, 750 tools etc. Some folks use different terms and make it hard for those not creative in the search to find the older wrenches. I got the double box end cheap that way. It was listed as 750 Honda wrench.
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I found an Ebay ad with 14 misc. wrenches, it included kawasaki and Yamaha wrenches and had the K0 cast shock spanner and correct three end wrenches.
I also got 3 extra 8x12mm spanners, and have many of the later tools collected in my quest for a full K0 set. One 8x12 with the big HM logo and two with the smaller HM logo. I would trade, looking for other correct tool kit parts. Tool bag, spark plug, file, red handle, extension handle with the hole etc.
The newer size wrenches have the big HM logo so is it safe to assume the smaller HM logo is older?
Any tips for cleaning/polishing without removing the finish? I'm doing a vinegar test cleaning. Scotchbrite/WD40 seems to help but sure is messy. I worry about removing the original finish, a brass scrub brush removed the crud but leaves the patina.
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Zinc plating oxidises (goes dull) so we clean off the oxidise. It then oxidises again and we clean it again and the cycle repeats until no zinc plate and the raw metal begins to oxidise ie rust. The gold bright finish on zinc is a process that keeps a nice finish and slows the oxidising process. Not totally though. Olive drab (or drab olive) is a similar added process which is more common today then gold bright. I think just leaving them and storing away from the atmosphere is the best way of keeping them in nice condition. My thoughts anyway. You can always have them cadmium plated which looks like zinc but doesn't oxidise (well very slowly) not many cadmium platers around these days though.
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It took me awhile but after several Ebay purchases of tool kits I have finally got a correct 1969 tool kit. In the posted photos I also took a photo of the back of the tools so you can see those stamped markings. Please let me know if any of the tools don't look correct.
Joe K.
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One more photo...
Joe K.
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Joe, your tool kit looks stellar. although i owned 4779 new back in the day, i have no clue what an original points file looks like. Yours certainly looks like possibly the part.... However, and i don't know if it means anything, the sketch in the parts book depicts a file with a round hole in the working end of the file. can anyone illuminate, elucidate...?
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Hi Steve,
Thank you for the compliment! I can say for sure that the file point is original Honda. I asked the same question about the hole in the top of the file in an earlier post of this thread. In all of my looking at file points in various Honda tool kits I haven't ever seen the hole. Only in the manual drawing.
Joe K.
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Does anyone have any idea why Honda made their wrenches with an 8mm/12mm and a 10mm/14mm? My way of thinking is that they should have been an 8mm/10mm and a 12mm/14mm. Perhaps to fit in the tool bag easier or make certain adjustments on the bike with these configurations? ???
Joe K.
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I'd guess there may be an instance of an 8mm head and a 10mm nut so you may get to it with two wrenches? Same with a 12/14. I'm not aware of any instances where that happens on our bikes. I noticed my Kawasaki has 13mm wrenches and hardware.
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My best guess, I think the top triple tree would need to use both the 12mm & 14mm wrenches at the same time to adjust.
DW
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Joe,
On your file question, the tool kits of that same era, from the CB450s (Black Bomber) had the same file that I have in two of my Sandcast tool kits, having a tang that is the exact same length and the file face.
The files are identical to the CB450 files and do not have a hole in the end. Both files are from very original bikes that have not had any modifications. I assume they are correct for the bike, so I hope others can weigh in with their observations.
Best,
DW
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Thank you, Duane for letting me know.
Joe K.