Honda CB750 Sandcast
The Restoration Shop => Exhaust => Topic started by: Steve Swan on February 21, 2010, 12:45:06 pm
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Riccardo asked me to post this reply of today from Yamiya.
FOR THOSE WHO SERIOUSLY WANT LOTUS ROOT EXHAUST, NOW APPEARS YOUR CHANCE TO ACT NOW.
Dear sir,
Thank you for your reply.
But we cannot sell LOTUS ROOT EARLY mufflers.
Since there is a problem on structure, It cannot run on a public road.
Therefore, if you buy 50 sets of a minimum lot collectively, we will
examine.
Thank you
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MOTORCYCLE YAMIYA
order@yamiya750.com
2-18-7KAMEJIMA NAKAMURA-KU
NAGOYA AICHI JAPAN
TEL 052-452-7230/FAX 052-452-7231@
http://www.yamiya750e.com
***********************************
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GREAT Steve!
Thanks
Riccardo
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Nice to see, lets act and order together.
Bojje
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How much for four lotus roots?
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Hi Guys,
Short answer, no one has a clue on price because it is not known IF Yamiya will even again produce more sets because the exhaust don't exist. Yet.
For Yamiya to be willing to consider making up more exhaust IS A BIG STEP on their part.
Riccardo VERY SUCESSFULLY is communicating with Yamiya. (I will not be in the loop communicating with Yamiya again. I have not spoke to anyone at Yamiya since 2006.)
I can offer a few tips, based on my experience.
1. You guys need to have a list of names of WHO will commit to 50 sets. How you get this list of names is up to you. (I did the footwork, continuously and on numerous occasions communicating with Yamiya in 2004-2006, it took 2 years to accomplish this, I am not doing this again, I have no relationship with anyone at Yamiya.)
2. You guys need a spokesman to communicate with Yamiya. Riccardo and Bo seem to be doing a great job with this.
3. I would suggest your spokesman tell Yamiya you are getting a list of commitments for the 50 sets so Yamiya knows you are taking action.
4. WHEN you have your list of names commiting to 50 sets, then be able to tell Yamiya, you can offer a deposit to secure the order.
5. DO WHAT YAMIYA TELLS YOU TO DO. As far as I am concerned, Yamiya is doing a big favor, just by being willing to consider producing more Lotus Root exhaust. (Some may differ with this statement, that's fine with me.)
6. JUST MY OPINION, TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT. I would be prepared to spend in the $2000+ range for a set. In the past, there were complaints about the cost of Yamiya exhaust. If any of you have new bikes, just try to purchase an exhaust system made of titanium or carbon fiber and see what you spend. If this rationale doesn't work for you, then try making the exhaust up yourself and see what you spend on machine equipment, tooling, materials and production. Or, install whatever exhaust you would like on your bike.
7. I DON'T MEAN TO OFFEND ANYONE. Having the opportunity to have these exhaust made for your purchase requires willingness, commitment, effort and pereverance on your part to work with Yamiya.
8. I will send out a system wide email, asking all BB members to read this thread.
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Please enlighten me. Why should we spend $2000.00 for one of these exhaust systems, when I see a new set of pipes one ebay for $1200.00?
I understand it's not 1969, but the original price of the whole motorcycle was less than $2000.00.
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Certain members asked me to write this post as an aid in their attempts to organize an effort showing interest to Yamiya for producing more early type exhaust. I am honoring their request.
Some owner/members are interested in having correct, original appearing parts for their bikes, other people are ok with having non-original appearing parts on their bike. Either approach should be fine with anyone.
Exhaust info and pics can be found on Production Models & Tech/Restoration Support for anyone with the enthusiasm and curiosity to read about exhaust whys and wherefores.
Nobody said anyone has to spend anything.
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Hi to All,
i've a list of 5 seriously owners interested on 10 sets.
I think that is the "LAST CHANCE" to have a corrects Lotus Root.
I want repeat the Steve's words: TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.....and i add.... FOR EVER !!!!
Dont cry owners if in the next years will be impossible to have these mufflers by Yamiya.
Contact me if you want add your name in the list (with VIN and engine numbers).
No lesstime, please.
Riccardo
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I have requested an explanation for what makes these pipes worth $2000.00. Your response fell far short of what I consider an adequate response. You said this will be the last chance to purchase these pipes from the original manufacture that is not entirely correct. Not more than a month ago on ebay, someone was selling a set of NOS for around $1100.00 (buy it now). I understand these pipes whether NOS or new manufactured are limited, but how is it you feel $2000.00 is a deal?
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doug21:
Supply and demand. Marty
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Doug....I believe that the Lotus Root ppipes mentioned here are "special" ($2000) because they are exact replacements for the pipes that originally came on the bikes with vin's under #4149.
These have the lotus root syle baffles which are not on the pipes now being sold for $1200. I think they would have the later K0 style baffles. (Correct me if I'm wrong)
The lotus root styles are very expensive to replicate...I hear.
Depends on how exacting a restoration you are going for.
Nobody but yourself and a discriminating buyer would be know the difference. (they sound better too Iv'e heard)
All this information is in the information pages on the website.
Hope this helps.
Steve
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To Doug21,
if possible post the item number sold on ebay. I want see these mufflers.
Thanks
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To Doug21,
please look to EBAY #170288322826, these USED mufflers was sold on ebay for $2.042,00, WITHOUT BAFFLES!!!!!
And the baffles are impossible to find!
Think about.
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Doug boy, Methinks you need to be told. Steve doesn't need to give you an explanation as to why these pipes cost $2000 because he doesn't make them or sell them. You can also find the explanation as to why these are unique by reading all about sandcast exhausts in the exhaust section of the SOOC website. If you want to complain about the price, tell Yamiya
But in simple terms, and this may be the key word in your case, the exhausts have totally different seams, have custom made baffles, no pipe indents and are made (essentially) by hand. The investor, Yamiya in this case, also had to have a special set of dies made to manufacture these pipes to original specs.
So in essence that is why they cost $2000. Marty said it, supply and demand.
Sooooooo, what I'm saying here is, if you had taken the time to read up on the information provided on these pipes (and that's free), you wouldn't be asking these stupid questions or making such dumb arse statements in the first place.
And if this explanation falls short of your expectations, then go tell OxFam, they care
PS Steve, as is usual, you've done an excellent job getting this far
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I guess I was wrong, I thought this web site was all about restoring a classic motorcycle to original, it seems you care more about modifying your bikes.
So let me get this straight, the pipes you are willing to pay $2000 for pipes that are not identical to the original exhaust system? You would rather have a re-manufactured set of pipes instead of a brand new in the box stock exhaust. I don't think any of you understand the English language. I know Steve isn't manufacturing the exhaust system, the whole thing doesnt make sense to me. From time to time someone finds a set of NOS (NEW OLD STOCK) pipes with the original factory boxes (yes, brand new 40 year old parts), lists them on ebay and sells them for under $2000, way under. I bought a set a year ago, used, no rust a couple of small dents (that can be repaired) for under $400 including shipping. And yes they are the early no part number set. Can you start to understand my confusion?
Hey is anyone interested in buying a couple of dozen Sand Cast wiring harnesses almost like the original, for say $1500 each?
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Once again you miss the mark.
KP said that the Yamiya ones, as the originals were, have totally diffferent characteristics from the later ones. Yamiya reproduces these characteristics in the pipes they offer (for $2000 not $1200) . These are exact replicas!
You may have bought the later ones....or K0 pipes with relief.....who knows.
You still have to have them repaired and rechromed ....not cheap ....even IF they were the original style.
After this it's time for brail or sign language Dude!
I give up.
Steve
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nobody said it's a deal except doug
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after reading about the pipes i do not understand what you are getting at doug21
the early pipes it would seem are nothing like the later pipes sold by honda dealers
there must be a bunch of owners restoring bikes that need pipes and my hunch would be there would never be enough good used sets to go around
i think what you are saying is very silly from a restorer viewpoint
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doug did'nt say he wants to buy pipes, so should lay off. dou'gs like hte 3 year old boy temper tantrim in the dime store w/ granma- jealous abouts omething he can't have. douf's showing off how smart he is- telling sandcasr guys how stupid they r to spend more moeny than him, arguing price at the air.. he can' t change t hat's ok so let him go
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I'm not sure you actually get it Doug. Seems you think all unstamped exhausts are the same. Well we can point you in the right direction for the info but we can't make you read it.
As Steve (Bickle) said, a used set generally requires work and will cost you a good deal for the pleasure. Once you patch up, rechrome etc etc, you have technically remanufactured that exhaust.
If you buy a set of exhausts off ebay (like you have) and fit these to another bike, technically you cannot call your bike unrestored or original, and that really is the nub of the matter. KP ;)
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Steve ,great job. Doug ,these pipes are not original, but they are correct for an early sandcast restoration. As we gain more knowledge of what is correct factory and the #s they come out as we more authentically restore our bikes. I've seen supposed Vic World early #restorations with stamped pipes. That is what was available at the time. 5 years ago I didn't even know what lotus root was. My Indian restorations are a good example. As we learn more ,more "correct" parts become available. What was a 95 point indian 4 in 1990 would be lucky 2 be an 80m point bike today. Most people would not know the difference between unmarked and lotus root. It's that kind of minutae that makes us passionet about our bikes. Its about gaining knowledge. There is nothing wrong with using any kind of pipes on our bikes , it just depends on the kind of restoration you are going for. I strive for factory correct in every detail I can. I love the research as I'm not a mechanic. Many people like a close rider or a custom. I enjoy the AMCA points judging and the knowledge gained. Other people don't. Who cares
. Bottom line... a very few people did a ton of research to figure out when the earliest pipes stopped. If you want a factory correct restoration before those #s you need the lotus roots. Thats it. Now try finding early 28 carbs to go with them. Eli