Honda CB750 Sandcast
K0 Korner => Everything K0 => Topic started by: UK Pete on October 29, 2012, 06:08:52 pm
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Hi all , i have been thinking as to which way i shall proceed with my K0 at first i was going to get it MOT'd register it and ride it as is for a year or so while i have a chance to gather parts to restore, but on closer inspection i have found the front end needs a total overhaul, so does the back end (swing arm bushes, missing spoke in rear wheel), and even worse the engine leaks oil from the cylinder head quite badly, so it is pretty much decided that i will tear it down and get stuck in with a restoration now rather than later, To kick things off i got the bike running , just needed a bit of work on the carbs, then rode the bike around to get the feel what was in need of doing, that is when it became apparent that both front and rear ends were bad, and it was clear the oil leak was more than just a drip, i cleaned up any chrome bits to access what was salvagable and what was to replace, it tuns out the double cut front guard is really solid with speckles of rust and a couple of small dings that are easily repaired, so that is on the re-chrome list
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/1969%20Honda%20CB750/074.jpg)
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/1969%20Honda%20CB750/077.jpg)
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/1969%20Honda%20CB750/076.jpg)
The rear guard is also in reasonable shape, and being the original well worth salvaging so that is also on the re-chrome list, again like the front it has a bit of mild surface rust , and a few dents, but the dents are where the rear light has been knocked and so are mostly hidden, the underside has been protected with some sort of wax oil and is really well preserved, as for the rear light bracket i have A NOS bracket, and chrome rear light back, the original lens is salvageble with a bit of polishing so all is good
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/1969%20Honda%20CB750/059.jpg)
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/1969%20Honda%20CB750/060.jpg)
(http://i924.photobucket.com/albums/ad90/UK-Pete/1969%20Honda%20CB750/062.jpg)
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More pictures of the strip down
Short plastic chain guard, it is all there, in dirty but good condition, luckily as reproduction ones are almost £200
originals very hard to come by
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/088.JPG)
Front brake all in good condition, just a bit of fading to the anodised parts
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/085.JPG)
the original no 8 bolts in great condition, they will clean up nicely so a few less to zinc plate
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E0.JPG)
Coils looking a bit worse for wear but considering the bike ticked over like a swiss watch at only 800 rpm, and reved cleanly from there upwards means to me they are worth keeping and restoring
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/080.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/081.JPG)
Original airbox, looks to be repairable , although i do have a nice new LPM one which i might use
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/071.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/072.JPG)
More of those lovely no 8 bolts, i think they were only on the pre K1 models
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/056.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/055.JPG)
Rear indicators and mountings , amazing condition, perfectly usable, just need to paint the brackets
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/054%7E0.JPG)
Carbs with the 4 seperate cables, apparently a bit awkward to set up properly,, but all there and working good
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/052.JPG)
Surprisingly all the electrics worked faultlessly, but i will have my work cut out restoring this lot
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/048.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/049.JPG)
Swing arm a bit of rust , but structuraly sound
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014.JPG)
Swing arm bearings are metal in this one, and were a real pig to get out
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011.JPG)
Front forks , need total overhaul, the chrome is good , but strangely Honda chose to only chrome the area of travel, the rest is bare steel so it goes rusty
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/009.JPG)
Fork internals, had a right job getting one of the retaining circlips out, also they had a mix of water and very smelly discoloured oil in them
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/005%7E0.JPG)
Engine out, i opted for the easy way lay the frame on its side and remove bolts and lift away from engine,
the engine is bit oily but it ran really sweet with no smoke, all the fins are in tact, but it leaks oil from the head quite badly, this will have a total strip paint and be fully reconditioned
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/006.JPG)
Frame had some rust but mostly surface, just a couple of pin holes in lower tube, which i enlarged out till i was back into sound metal, then i welded them shut and ground it down and sanded smooth
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/002.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/005.JPG)
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Looks like a pretty nice job on the frame repair.
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Thanks Mark, i have started reading back through your restoration posts and find it really interesting, i was looking to see if you had a K0 rebuild thread, as i read on the SOHC/4 site that you restored one
Pete
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I was wondering how to get out my stubborn swing arm shock bushes, then i came up with the old socket trick and threaded bar, a bit of heat from a gas torch and wind up the nut they just pushed out,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/018.JPG)
shame the steering head bearings wern't as easy, turns out who ever put them in had done it with the bearing seat at an angle and so they were sort of friction welded in, i got them out eventually but will have to file the chived up metal back smooth again
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Thought i would do a bit of work on the front end, i am not sure what people do with their forks ie replace them cause they are rusty at the top, or just treat the rust and re use, i decided to reuse my fork stauntions as the chrome on the travel part of fork is perfect, the top part which honda left as exposed steel is not seen and the cost of replacing the tubes just because of unseen rust is not worth it as it would just add another £200+ pounds to the restoration cost for me to know that hidden behind the fork ears is shiney chrome
what i did was rub them down, treat with a chemical rust convertor, then a fine coat of silver paint
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_001.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_005.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_006.JPG)
I stripped the top yolk of its paint and gave it a couple of coats of satin black, the finish is almost spot on to the original, i know as i have a NOS one to compare to
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_007.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_010.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_016.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_019.JPG)
While i was in the mood i removed the steering lock and bearing stripped and re-painted the lower clamp, but used gloss black as that is what was used originally
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/k0_012.JPG)
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My tank was looking very tatty and i was unsure to its condition beolow all the horrible black paint, so i just had to strip the paint off to access the state of the metal, to my surprise it is in fantastic condition there is only one dent and virtually no rust inside and out , plus the added bonus that it is the original correct tank for the year , just look at those lovely wrinkles and the original cap
Getting the mucky old paint off, the original colour was candy ruby red
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E1.JPG)
Lovelly deep ridge wrinkles
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/003%7E1.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/004%7E1.JPG)
No rust inside
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/006%7E0.JPG)
Starting to reveal the beutifully preserved metal on this 43 year old tank
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/009%7E0.JPG)
I am so pleased with this , i spent a lot of money buying this bike but having most of the original parts is sometimes priceless
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/010%7E0.JPG)
Only one dent, does anyone have any suggestions on how to get this dent out?
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E0.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E0.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/015%7E0.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/008%7E0.JPG)
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I was wondering how to get out my stubborn swing arm shock bushes, then i came up with the old socket trick and threaded bar, a bit of heat from a gas torch and wind up the nut they just pushed out,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/018.JPG)
shame the steering head bearings wern't as easy, turns out who ever put them in had done it with the bearing seat at an angle and so they were sort of friction welded in, i got them out eventually but will have to file the chived up metal back smooth again
Nice tip. I've always had trouble with that. What size sockets are you using?
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Not sure what the socket size was i just went through them till i found the appropriate sizes
Made some more progress today, i was thinking of a plan of attack which way best to tackle the restoration when it occured to me that my preffered method of installing the engine is to lay it on its side and lower the frame over it, so i really need to build the engine sooner rather than later as i wont be putting anything back together until the engine is in the frame, so i set about getting a decent size bench for engine building, the perfect place is in the warm and dry so in my nice heate garage it is, on top of my pool table, which happens to be where i built my F2 engine
The problem as always is man handling the engine, you have to so carefull lifting these as its quite easy to bust your bollocks and back, so below is how i tackled it
First of all create the space
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E1.JPG)
Get the engine out and onto a scate board
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E1.JPG)
Up into the garage and on to a lower work bench
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/017%7E0.JPG)
And onto the build bench
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/028.JPG)
Its first time i have had a good look at the engine, the main thing is no bad cosmetic damage , all the fins are in great condition, also the lower half of the engine looks like its never been disasembled before which is always a plus point i find, another good point is that the engine ran really well it just leaked oil so i am hoping for no nasty surpises
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/022.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/023.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/025.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/026.JPG)
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Here goes then time to strip the engine
Rocker cover off,a well preserved number written on inside
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/006%7E1.JPG)
all looks good in there
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E3.JPG)
Cam towers off they both have a code on the side, could it be a date ?
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/016%7E2.JPG)
I have had one of these snap before so i am not taking any chances as this one is in real tight, a bit of heat and a hit from the hammer free,s it up
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/009%7E2.JPG)
Off with the head,it has had a serious oil leak for some time by the looks of it
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/010%7E2.JPG)
Off with the barrels
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/013%7E0.JPG)
Open up the crankcase, all looks good, vitually no sludge, just a few bit of muck in the oil strainer
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/029.JPG)
Washed the cases in my parts washer, more preserved numbers written inside
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/008%7E1.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/009%7E1.JPG)
Could this be the bearing code on the underside of front upper crankcase
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E2.JPG)
At last some sort of order, all small bits baged and labled, cases cylinders and head all washed clean , now i can work my way through this lot and see what i need to order
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/033.JPG)
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Could this be the bearing code on the underside of front upper crankcase
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E2.JPG)
That is what they are.
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Done my battery box and electrics this weekend, a bit random i know, one minute i am doing the tank then engine, the next i am doing this but i suppose it pays to do anything as it is all a step nearer to the end
(http://)Here is a reminder of the battery box and electrics
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/048.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/049.JPG)
Zinc plating some of the bolts and brakets
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/027%7E0.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/005%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/030%7E0.JPG)
Lots of other bit done , bring it all together and it looks real good i think,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/009%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/008%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/007%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/006%7E2.JPG)
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This thread has had 275 visits, i am taking lots of time and trouble to bring this restoration thread to you guys, yet only one person has made any comments on here (Thanks MarkB), YOU GUYS SURE DO KNOW HOW TO MAKE A NEW GUY UNWELCOME ON THIS SITE
I am not sure if it worth doing any more posts here, i though it would be interesting for people to see how much a non sandcast 69 bike had in common with a sanmdcast engined 69 bike, i suppose i should stay a lurker like many and just read the odd posts that crop up from time to time
It is a great site full of info which i was trying to add to but sadly enough is enough , i will carry on with this thread but probably on another site
Pete
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This thread has had 275 visits, i am taking lots of time and trouble to bring this restoration thread to you guys, yet only one person has made any comments on here (Thanks MarkB), YOU GUYS SURE DO KNOW HOW TO MAKE A NEW GUY UNWELCOME ON THIS SITE
I am not sure if it worth doing any more posts here, i though it would be interesting for people to see how much a non sandcast 69 bike had in common with a sanmdcast engined 69 bike, i suppose i should stay a lurker like many and just read the odd posts that crop up from time to time
It is a great site full of info which i was trying to add to but sadly enough is enough , i will carry on with this thread but probably on another site
Pete
+1
I have learned to keep my mouth shut on this site (ooops sorry) So much so that I sold all my sandcasts and just pop in here once in awhile as I still have my diecast. (Great build thread by you by the way) See your build on SOHC4 I guess.
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Pete
With so few members there is often little or no participation for long periods, then something really interesting pops up and wham!...We have some chatter. I have learned it's just the nature of the beast. I don't get bent out of shape when folks don't respond to a post. I'm doing my restoration thread as a way to document the tear down and reassembly of 576. If people want to comment great! Perhaps these stats will paint a better picture for you:
http://cb750sandcastonly.com/smf_forum/index.php?action=stats (http://cb750sandcastonly.com/smf_forum/index.php?action=stats)
I'm not quite sure what Bickle meant when he said he learned to keep his mouth shut here? I came in a newbie like most others and was treated very well right off the hop. :)
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This thread has had 275 visits
I agree with Wayne. This is a small group compared to sites like the SOHC4. I think 275 views in a little less than a month shows plenty of interest. By the way Pete, I saw that you started a thread on the SOHC4 site. Good idea. I have my #97 restoration thread there too.
Mark
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Pete
As a Newbie myself to the sandcast world, I watch and learn. Your post is excellent along with all the great pics, please keep up the good work!
John
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I usually check the forum for "unread posts" twice a day and 9 times out of 10 get an empty response. It does not dampen my interest. If you consider there were only 7414 made, and a little less than 400 accounted for, and some of us own more than 1, it is a SMALL population. Most of us have a job and may not be as judicious and giving of our time as are Mark, Wayne, Pete, and previously others.
Thank you guys for taking the interest and especially your precious time to post as often as you do. This is THE PLACE for Sandcast / K0 information. I see this forum as more of a technical repository than a FaceBook what happened in my life today gig. Personally I like it like that. You have to read literally 100's of posts on SOHC to glean a tidbit of value.
The guys on SOHC are great but they generally think we are crazy to revere the Sandcast as we do and could care less about what changes were made between 232 and 233. Not sure why some may feel inimidated on/by this forum. I know I have probably posted some less than postworthy comments and have never received any criticism unless I am just too dumb to recognize it as such. You can get FLAMED in a hurry over on SOHC if you have less than 5000 posts most of which are useless. IMHO
Thanks Pete, keep up the good work.
Keith
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Wayne , i do understand its a small site and even more so now i have read the stats, i suppose my point was more that 275 views 2 replies 0 words of encouragement, made me wonder if i was in the right place
but hey to be honest i got out the wrong side of bed and typed it out before giving it much thought
Mark , i have recently read through lots of your restoration posts on SOHC4 and really have learnt lots, I will keep up my postings of this restoration both here and the sohc forums
John thanks for the kind words just a couple of posts like yours is all i meant thanks
Keith , wise words and thanks for the encouragment
Pete
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Pete, i appreciate the fact you are doing much of the work youself, i.e., zinc plating, i will assume probably painting..
We have a very fine core of participating members who don't flaunt their egotism by talking down or taunting other BB participants.
There's anumber of of BB on any given website, but very few actual participting members.
People that really are interested in things sandcast, do, over time stick; even though they may have periods where their particiaption on the B waxes and wanes. Or, perhaps, i should speak for my self; i've been doing more waning than waxing !
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Hey Pete,
I'm one of those 275 views and read every thread posted on this site and just like Keith, visit every day (well almost every day :-[ ) Don't be disillusioned. The lack of posted comments doesn't mean we are not taking an interest cos we are. As Steve said, participation waxes and wanes and some just enjoy taking in the various threads and comments without feeling the need to post. Keep the posts coming. KP ;)
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Yes i understand and i am usually the last person to say negative things on a forum,
I am glad people are interested it keeps my enthusiasm up, so here are some more bits i done today
The metalwork of the front footpegs was powdercoated, i zinc/nickle plated the pins,and washers, also seeing as new rubber is quite cheap i thought it would be rude not to so they got finished off with the new rubbers
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/007%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/012%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/016%7E3.JPG)
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Very impressive on the plating! I've thought about trying to do that but I've got plenty to do the way it is.
Mark
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Pete
I'm going to take this opportunity to chime in and say thanks for your contribution to the site. I think everything has been said that needs to be said about our groups participation. Now, onto that zinc! I forgot some pieces when i had mine done, and I am unhappy with other bits. Care to do them for me?? J.K.! Nice job doing it yourself! :)
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Thanks for the comments
I forgot to post the pictures of my frame and various bits after they had been to the powder coaters, so here they are,
I sent the frame swingarm and battery box back as i felt the finish was quite poor compared to when i last had one done, this is the photo of the parts first time round you cant see the finish clearly
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/008_28229.JPG)
Here is one when i got them back after being re-done, i am much happier now
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/013_28229.JPG)
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Hi Pete, you seem to be making great progress. Keep posting, always good to see how someone else tackles various problems. I see "my" K1 is still looking good (in an un-restored sort of way). F2 real nice too ( I like them ALL, even though my sandcasts are at the heart of the obsession)
Cheers - Chris R.
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Hi Chris, it would be rude not to sneak in some of my other SOHC's in the back ground, especially your old K1, i have only managed a few rides on it this year due to that nasty bike accident i had, but when i eventually did get back on, there was a huge grin on my face , as i roared through the neighbourhood with them delightfull HM300's
Pete
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Nice job Pete, very inspiring. I like how you do most things yourself too. How'd you do that zinc coating, is it difficult or dangerous? I recently acquired my ko which is the same as yours :) don't forget to replace that skinny inferior output shaft bearing and the shaft too! Lots of failures, I believe the dbl.roller bearing started with K2..or K3....
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Hi slyguy thanks for the comments, Zinc plating can be very temperamental, i have found many problems when doing it , so many things can go wrong and ruin the set up, i am going to write up on my experiences and give some tips on how to do it, but i have to say it is very satisfying when you do it yourself, if you read the warnings on the chemicals it makes you wonder how harmful the stuff is, do it in a ventilated area and always wear gloves and it shoild be ok
What is with this skinny output bearing and shaft, is it a must to change it? i have not read of anyone doing this change,
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What is with this skinny output bearing and shaft, is it a must to change it? i have not read of anyone doing this change,
I'm curious on this one as well. I was thinking of replacing the shaft on 576 as it seems a bit worn and I was hoping it might tighten up some of the sprocket "wobble". Of course I was going to do the brg's along with it.
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As long as there is no galling, significant surface errosion or other defects, replacing the bearing should be all that is required. If there's wobble, is the shaft bent ?
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Sorry Steve. I meant the looseness of the front sprocket on the shaft splines allowing the sprocket to wobble. Thought a new shaft might tighten it up a bit??
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Now that I got an old 750, I got in touch with my ole friend who I worked with/for back in the early 70's fixing motorcycles. He was well known in the area for his expertise and specialized building street race engines in particuliar (he was a certified Honda tech too). These first models had the skinny bearings that would fail/seize causing shaft breakage...which would also usually take out the rear case halves too..:( Honda developed a dbl. roller bearing which corrected this problem and since the bearing width is greatly increased, sunseqently the collar/shaft is wider too and best to replace both at the same time. In fact when I contacted him on this early 750, that was one of the first things he reminded me to do"Replace that output shaft and bushing"! LOL!
I was just thinking...Prolly more so if you get on it and/or holeshots maybe? iirc he said the bearing gets dry and/or it seizes...
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Apparently, "back in the day", output shaft bearing failures were known to occur, also chain breakages. I do wonder how much of it was down to the use of inferior / badly worn and/or adjusted chains (if chain tension is too tight for any reason, it will give that output bearing a hard time, particularly as chain tension changes as the rear suspension goes up and down). My#5298 when stripped at 32,000 miles ran well enough, but did have some pitting of one of the output shaft bearing races maybe due to it having stood for many years (roller /ball bearings do not hold oil when stood, and so can dry out and suffer light corrosion due to condensation or damp, which can then cause bearing track pitting). Both bearings were changed of course, but only with the original single row ones (genuine NOS Honda parts)
#5298 now has 122,000 miles on it, so 90,000 miles (UK touring two up,track days, hard use on the Isle of Man TT circuit, etc) on those replacement "skinny" bearings. I do not believe it is necessary to upgrade if good quality modern chains are used (I use DID or RK heavy duty type non "O" ring type with the press fit side plate/split link) and correctly maintained, which in my case includes fitting of a new chain every time the rear tyre is changed.
It is possible to fit the later K3 type double roller output bearing into earlier engines, but only if the later output shaft is also fitted. For those that are worried about bearing failure, I suppose that would be a way to upgrade, although the double row bearing will still not be fully supported by the crankcases due to the casting thickness in that region being less in sandcast cases than in the later K3 cases which the double row bearing is intended to fit.
Just my experiences / view - we should each do whatever we feel comfortable with.
Cheers - Chris R.
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Very interesting, now i have a shall i or shall i not situation, i will have a good inspection tommorrow to access the situation, my thoughts are that the bike has managed 43 years on the skinny bearing so as long as the shaft is good then maybe just do the bearing
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I'm trying to get add. info on the output bearing. Also, hey Pete, what'd ya do to get the battery box/components/wiring soo clean anyways?
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More on the output shaft. Evidently "in 1972 Honda issued a dealer change order on existing inventory and then changed the parts (Bearing and shaft) because of bearing failure and then added a chain guide so if disaster struck, the chain would feed out the bottom of the sprocket without punching a hole in the engine case. The old bearing was a 6305 and was changed to 5206 double row radial ball bearing." Of course back then were different times and alot of folks rode 'em much harder than a vintage collector would these days. That being said, it might just be that that was a strong contributing factor of the failure? I don't know as of yet but Honda proactively stepped up with a design change undoubtedly either to fend off negative product image and/or the cost of warranty repairs.
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Slyguy, the battery box was powder coated, all the rubbers were cleaned in soapy water and silicon spray, the soleniod was polished with metal polish, its fixing bracket, and any nuts bolts and washers zinc plated and yellow passivated, the regulator was replaced with a good clean one from ebay, although i have dismantled the old one and plated that as well but i think the ebay one looks better, i resprayed the rectifier and cleaned the wiring with thinners, and the battery wire is a new one from Honda, i have to say i was really pleased with the outcome, i dont usually bother to this extent with the hidden stuff , but i want this bike to have the WOW factor and it is a challenge to get reasonable detail
As for the output shaft thanks for the info, i do have a k7 one somewhere so i could upgrade , like you say though being a vintage collector and enthusiast and having to share my time with 24 bikes its not going to be worked hard, to be honest i will probably do less than 2000 miles a year, so skinny bearing it is, keeping the bike as it was built
Pete
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hi guys, a quick word of caution regarding changing outshaft bearings from later k models to the k0. i tried to go down this road years ago when i had a spare k4 engine laying around, and i know the double bearing output shaft that i tried to use did not fit ,although it was a thicker bearing it was thinner on the outside and was a sloppy fit in the cases and of course there is no locating groove , so i stuck with the proper setup,it could well be that earlier k3 and k2 bearings fit as Honda always upgraded the later models its your choice really, but i prefer to keep them as they came from the factory. BTW nice job so far pete . ;)
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I restored the the seat catch, was really pleased how it came out, its another small bit to tick off the list
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/019_28229.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/024_28229.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/025_28229.JPG)
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Another busy weekend on the bike, made myself up a long plating tank so i could do the long things like engine bolts, and brake rod, then plated the brake rod
below is it just out the tank before passivating
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/003%7E4.JPG)
I then spent all of yesterday prepping the engine cases, and spraying them, let them dry overnight , then oven cured the paint today, as i type this they are just cooling down, the good thing now is i can proceed to check all the bits and rebuild the engine bottom
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/009%7E4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/012%7E3.JPG)
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What type paint do you use fo the engine cases ?
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Nice work! There's nothing better than working on nice "new" cases. :)
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steve, i used simoniz engine enamel, after baking it in the oven for 1.5 hours at 220' it is rock hard and has a good finish, i am going to spray up a bit of metal with the stuff, bake it and then try the petrol test on it
Mark , yes you are right it is so enjoyable building up an engine when the parts are all clean ,
Pete
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Keep us posted on your petrol resistant paint testing.
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I have gathered all my engine component markings, and have read other peoples posts on date markings, what i can gather is 44 is the year 1969 and the next two numbers the month and day, as i am documenting the whole build i might as well gather all my date markings together, it really pleases me that the bottom of this engine was totally untoched, the top had only had the head off, everything that was put together in 1969 is in tact and re-usable, obviously i will replace all the usuall serviceable items
Clutch basket 01/10/1969
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/normal_012%7E4.JPG)
cam carriers the 07/10/1969 first 4 is partly worn away
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/normal_016%7E1.JPG)
Rocker cover 29/8/1969
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/normal_006%7E1.JPG)
Crank cases 26/09/1969
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/normal_005%7E1.JPG)
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Gathered the bottom end parts together, took them apart and gave them a good clean and inspection, i have to say the condition for 43 years is amazing, very little wear, the only parts that need replacing are the primary chain tensioner and cam tensioner wheels as these are rock hard and starting to loose bits off them,and of course the chains will be replaced, i will change the output shaft outer bearing even though mine is smooth running and reusable, i am only changing it as i had already ordered the new bearing before checking the old
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E4.JPG)
Output shaft has had an easy life by the looks
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/010%7E3.JPG)
Started putting the parts together and back in the engine, it took me about 5 minutes to remember the easy way of reinstating the kickstart spring, i was scratching my head for ages trying to remember how the f--k i did it last time, i put in the new primary chain tensioner,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/003%7E5.JPG)
Then the rest of the parts
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/012%7E5.JPG)
It will stay like this for a while, till i get the rest of parts for the engine build, nearly there though, i have recieved most of the parts i ordered here they are , just need gaskets and a few more orings
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E4.JPG)
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Hi Pete,on picture of primary chain,chains should not be exactly side by side, but one should be advanced one tooth. Often one is slightly longer than the other then the longest side will embrayage.Sorry for my English
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Hi Bowswell, not quite sure what you mean, as far as i can see if the cogs are side by side then the chains will be side by side, thats exactly how they were when i took it apart, however i noticed a green and brown dot on the chains but i can find no mention anywhere as to what they are for
If anyone has any info on this subject please chime in as i dont want to mess up
Pete
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please check this and compare with yours picture.
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What i see in your picture is the link plates are offset rather than side by side , is that what you meant, if so where did you find out this info, i have read everywhere i can, and googled the subject but not seen anything, i will see if i can find a Honda manual to download and check there next
Thanks for the information
Pete
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Yes,I can't find tread in soch4 forum or in HONDAMAN book.Something about harmonic noise or vibration in hi rpm.
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Wish me luck as i am starting my gauge restoration, it is amazing just how much money there is in getting hold of a decent set of restored gauges, even the cost of home restoration on old gauges is high, with the potential to f--k it up as well
Anyway here goes
First of all snap of the rear plastic lip
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/019%7E0.JPG)
Next carefully prise off the needle, this is the part where i wonder if i should be doing this myself
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/020%7E1.JPG)
I got myself a small philips screwdriver which fitted the two face plate bolts and removed them, to reveal beautifully preserved internals, even the light shaft rubber boots were intact and looking good,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/022%7E0.JPG)
The damping all seems fine, so i dont think there is much else to do in here, so i stick the the new jewels to the new face plate
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/023%7E1.JPG)
Dab of paint on the needle tip, put it all to one side , let the paint dry and i come back to it for reassmbly later
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/026%7E1.JPG)
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Yes,I can't find tread in soch4 forum or in HONDAMAN book.Something about harmonic noise or vibration in hi rpm.
This has been discussed many times at SOHC.net and is a pet of mine. I have reviewed many pictures of virgin lower ends and there is NO consistency from the factory as to whether the chains should be synched or staggered. Many people have stated that they should be one way or another, but there is no verifiable back up to either position. I am open to anything scientific one has to say.
I received this as a PM from HondaMan: "I'll make a post of this when I can get my picture, later, but...I just disassembled a virgin 750K7 engine and found painted-on timing 'marks' on the primary chains, and they align the plate-to-plate setup we were kicking around earlier. So, it looks like Honda aligned them instead of staggering them, when new." With his permission. "We were kicking around earlier" refers to the conversation he and I had on the subject.
This is not conclusive as I have seen at least 2 virgin bottom ends where the chains were staggered. This leads me to believe Honda didn't care. The chains in my current project are synched. FWIW.
Ron
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[/color]20878]
Yes,I can't find tread in soch4 forum or in HONDAMAN book.Something about harmonic noise or vibration in hi rpm.
This has been discussed many times at SOHC.net and is a pet of mine. I have reviewed many pictures of virgin lower ends and there is NO consistency from the factory as to whether the chains should be synched or staggered. Many people have stated that they should be one way or another, but there is no verifiable back up to either position. I am open to anything scientific one has to say.
I received this as a PM from HondaMan: "I'll make a post of this when I can get my picture, later, but...I just disassembled a virgin 750K7 engine and found painted-on timing 'marks' on the primary chains, and they align the plate-to-plate setup we were kicking around earlier. So, it looks like Honda aligned them instead of staggering them, when new." With his permission. "We were kicking around earlier" refers to the conversation he and I had on the subject.[/color]
This is not conclusive as I have seen at l[/color][/color]east 2 virgin bottom ends where the chains were staggered. This leads me to believe Honda didn't care. The chains in my current project are synched. FWIW.
Ron
Good imformation Ron, for what its worth i have lined up the green dots on the chain, this makes it link to link
Ok so here are pictures of the gauges back together, there is still more work to be done, i will put new shrink tubing on the wiring, as it is getting a bit hard , also i wont seal up the bottom with silicon until the clocks are up and running on the bike, other than that here they are for know, all the hard work done
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E5.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/003%7E6.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/004%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/007%7E5.JPG)
The rear chrome plates are ok but not perfect, thing is that the replacement ones from Honda are not the same as the originals, so its either keep as is , rechrome or replace with modern alternative
Here are the originals
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/013%7E3.JPG)
here is an original left, next to the new style right
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E5.JPG)
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I was about to reassemble the bottom end the other day when i realised that the engine bolts were looking a bit scruffy , having gone to the trouble of restoring all other bits on the bike it would be a shame to leave out the engine bolts, so i spent a whole day yesterday blasting each bolt, then cleaning the threads followed by zinc/ nickle plating, i finished at about 9 in the evening, i even did all the washers
Here are some pictures, i think a combination of passivating too long and the temperature gave mixed results, they have a sort of yellow hue to them which is exagerated by the flourescent lights, but on the whole i am very pleased i did it now, another job out the way
Upper and lower case bolts and washers seperated
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/015%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/010%7E4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E5.JPG)
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Excellent! I am waiting for LeCrams gauge covers and I will doing this work soon.
When I was restoring my K2 gauges I used a fork to take off the needle. I worked perfect! Let the fork press on one of the (or both) small screws and it will be quite easy to get it loose.
I attach a picture!
/Ken
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The shaft the needle fits on to has a taper; as is the hole in needle which fits on shaft.
My experience, having restored around 20 sets of these gauges, give the needle a gentle anti-clockwise upward twisting motion, the needle comes right off.
To re-install, give needle a gentle downward anti-clockwise motion.
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Greetings Mr Kenhan/Ken!I noticed you have no high beam/indicator lights on your spedo gauge-is your tac/rpm gauge also missing oil+neutral idiot lights as my ko are? Merry Christmas! Tim
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Hi nmbr12,
No it´s no problem, the example picture was from restoring my gauges for my K2 CB750. For my Sandcast I have the old gauges with plastic covers, beam and flasher lights and so on.
Merry Christmas to all of you!! In Sweden our Christmas day is dec 24 so at present it looks like a Disneymovie outside, lots of snow and new snow pouring slowly down!
/Ken
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I found this for you Pete.
http://www.satanicmechanic.org/pridrive.shtml (http://www.satanicmechanic.org/pridrive.shtml)
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Thanks for that Bowswell, luckily i have still got the cases apart so i can do that , anything the late great Axl recommends is usually well researched and worth doing
Pete
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Thanks for that Bowswell, luckily i have still got the cases apart so i can do that , anything the late great Axl recommends is usually well researched and worth doing
Pete
Granted, and with all due respect to Axl, RIP.
However, regardless of source, I always recoil a bit when I'm told to do something someway with no reason for it, especially when we have eyewitness accounts that the factory did not do it that way.
Practically, it probably doesn't matter a whit for all the miles most of us will put on a restored engine.
I should say to complete the post, that i have seen pictures of (supposedly) virgin engines being disaassembled on SOHC4.net, where the chains are both aligned on some and staggerred on others indicating to me the factory didn't care.
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Fork lowers now polished, i stripped the laquer which appeared to be etched in to the ally, quite difficult to remove, non of the usual strippers seemed to work, anyway once i got it all off i polished up the aluminium and i will stop it oxidising by wiping over with ACF50, this also takes off some of the gloss and so will make it quite similar to the original, i still cant make up my mind wether to buy new chrome fork tubes or use the originals,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/016%7E4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/017%7E3.JPG)
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a little bit of progress, i installed taper roller bearings on the steering stem and re- fixed the aluminium date plate using new rivets, but best of all look what father chrismas got me, a nice new set of rear shocks, i can't believe how much David silver charges for these shocks, they are one hundred and ninety nine pounds each plus 20% VAT plus six pound delivery total just short of 500 pounds, fecking daylight robbery
needless to say i bought them elswhere much cheaper, in fact a good percentage of the parts i buy now come from USA or Germany as they are cheaper than our Usual UK suppliers
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/005%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/006%7E3.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/007%7E6.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/008%7E3.JPG)
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Get your original springs re-chromed and replace the newer type as the K0 springs are different to the later production type
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Get your original springs re-chromed and replace the newer type as the K0 springs are different to the later production type
I want say that the new production tipe, during the ride, are very noise.
I returned 2 sets to DSS but the problems remains the same.
Riccardo
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Kp nice bit of info on the springs, i did not notice as i had not bothered comparing, i am glad i did not get rid of them, at least i now have the option to keep as near to the original as possible
Here are my originals, i see that the coils are tighter /closer together than the replacements
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/003%7E7.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E6.JPG)
And the new ones,
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/008%7E3.JPG)
Riccardo, what sort of noise do your shocks make, is it intermitent or is there noise every time they compress
Pete
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hi Pete, if I can make a suggestion - your original shocks are in nice condition. If you remove and simply clean up the spring, is the chrome good enough to stand up to fresh chrome? once rechromed, you lose the satin finish the surface has.
I'd suggest the noise they make is as they compress, they make a squishing sound which is common to gas shocks/struts.
Regards
Steven.
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I am getting my bodywork ready to go to the painters, i had previously stripped the paint off the top of my tank but stopped short of doing the underside, its one of those horrible jobs but i got stuck in and stripped it bare, it had to be done as i needed to see that it was not rusting, alot of painters would just blow over the bottom without any prep,
In the process of stripping it i revealed a date code on the tank, it looks to me to be 1 / 10 /69, so thats another one to add to my date codes on this build,
I am still in two minds whether to use the LPM side panels i have already bought or buy the ones with the mire mesh tabs from z1900, Also i need to get some new fork ears, i cant believe reproduction ones are so costly, anyone have any suggestions where to buy fork ears ?
Pete
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/123.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/126.JPG)
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I have bought some tank decals from ebay Germany, they look real nice, but the problem is you have to cut them form the vinyl sheet,do i use a scapel or scissors, has anyone else used these or am i wasting my time, what are other people using when repainting there tanks?
These are the ones i bought the listing does not state you have to cut them out yourself
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fuel-Tank-Decal-Stripe-Kit-Black-Gold-Honda-CB750-SOHC-K0-K1-K2-Screen-Print-/160992000907?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item257bdefb8b (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fuel-Tank-Decal-Stripe-Kit-Black-Gold-Honda-CB750-SOHC-K0-K1-K2-Screen-Print-/160992000907?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item257bdefb8b)
pete
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:o you could try soaking them in hot water they might be transfers.
i bought mine from silvers i think and they are already cut to shape, not even sure if they are transfers it was that long ago ive yet to use them as i have put them somewhere safe ::) i will find them one day
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I just noticed dave silvers has started selling the gold ones, before he only listed the black , i might email him to see if his are already cut, i cant be the only one on this forum who has had to get a paint job done with new decals, although saying that i am sure i read somewhere the tanks up until 1971 had the tank striping hand painted,
pete
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Yep, the K0 are hand painted, sunny gold I think but others can confirm the color. I opt for hand paint myself but there are several sources of pre-made stripes. I've not seen ones that aren't pre-cut such as the ones you have KP
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Yep, the K0 are hand painted,
;) yes just confirming what KP has said, the K0 tank stripes was definitely hand painted ,come to think of it I might not have had mine from silvers ,but I did get them off eBay a long time ago, so it was probably from the states, ::) not even sure about that now
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Hello
regarding your gauge restoration
do you refill the damper pot???
which oil quality??
thank you
[/color]20878]
Yes,I can't find tread in soch4 forum or in HONDAMAN book.Something about harmonic noise or vibration in hi rpm.
This has been discussed many times at SOHC.net and is a pet of mine. I have reviewed many pictures of virgin lower ends and there is NO consistency from the factory as to whether the chains should be synched or staggered. Many people have stated that they should be one way or another, but there is no verifiable back up to either position. I am open to anything scientific one has to say.
I received this as a PM from HondaMan: "I'll make a post of this when I can get my picture, later, but...I just disassembled a virgin 750K7 engine and found painted-on timing 'marks' on the primary chains, and they align the plate-to-plate setup we were kicking around earlier. So, it looks like Honda aligned them instead of staggering them, when new." With his permission. "We were kicking around earlier" refers to the conversation he and I had on the subject.[/color]
This is not conclusive as I have seen at l[/color][/color]east 2 virgin bottom ends where the chains were staggered. This leads me to believe Honda didn't care. The chains in my current project are synched. FWIW.
Ron
Good imformation Ron, for what its worth i have lined up the green dots on the chain, this makes it link to link
Ok so here are pictures of the gauges back together, there is still more work to be done, i will put new shrink tubing on the wiring, as it is getting a bit hard , also i wont seal up the bottom with silicon until the clocks are up and running on the bike, other than that here they are for know, all the hard work done
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E5.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/003%7E6.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/004%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/007%7E5.JPG)
The rear chrome plates are ok but not perfect, thing is that the replacement ones from Honda are not the same as the originals, so its either keep as is , rechrome or replace with modern alternative
Here are the originals
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/013%7E3.JPG)
here is an original left, next to the new style right
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E5.JPG)
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No i did not do the damping oil as it seemed ok, however i have not seald the instruments in their cases so i can easily get to them if they jump around when i get it on the road
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Just delivered my bodywork to the painters, i have asked him to hand paint the tank stripes rather than use decals, can someone confirm this is the correct way for a K0, fingers crossed the guy will do a good job, the trouble is i am already having some regrets about using the LPM side covers and airbox,i thought they were good value for money and less brittle however those are the + points the minus points are no holes for badges, replica stamped on the inside, and worse of all is they have no tangs for retaining the grilles, anyway its to late now and all these points will not be seen , i also have massive problems with my head and barrels, i will do a post with pictures when i get time as i want some help here so i dont mess up building the engine
Pete
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Yep, painted stripes
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pete,
I have read every word on your restore, awesome job! I am in the beginning stages of a restore myself, and trying to learn all I can. your pictures and techniques are most impressive! I am most impressed with the replating you do yourself, not to mention the attention to tiny detail that you achieve. I hope to see your die cast up and running soon! best luck and kind regards from usa!
and keep up the great work and awesome pictures!!
cheers, john
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Thanks for the kind words john, i have slowed down on the resto past few months but i am getting the urge to speed things up a bit, i am struggling to get the original candy blue green colour right , so i have bought a nos part so i can get my painter to match it perfectly, i also have found someone to tig weld my 2 hole hub where there is a chunk missing, but my top end of engine is the problem at moment once i have sorted that out things will start moving quicker
pete
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hmmmm pete,
slowed down? mine came to a grinding halt... I run a small home based business, I have a two year old and a four year old that are with me all day... my 4wd work truck spun a front axle... my fridge died... my furnace died... repaired everything but the fridge myself, bought new appliances... oh I remodeled my little girl's room, with new furniture... new carpet in the boy's room... let's see... my super nice lawn care guy was here illegally and got deported so I am back to cutting my own grass... getting too old at 48 to push a effing lawn mower so I bought a rider... all four Chinese tubes popped within 3 mows, what a chore to fix, can't get your fingers in the dinky rims... replaced several yards of rotted concrete myself... brake job on the wife's car... u joints on my work truck... this is just the last 12 months... with the pile of cash and the hours I have spent, I could have restored a whole truck load of bikes :P
I think I read that you lost your job... welcome to the club... that's why I am self employed now... happened to me 4.5 years ago, lost a job of 15 years with a wife 8 months pregnant... :o
hang in there brother! life gets in the way sometimes... your k0 looks fantastic mate ;) looking forward to the end results!
kind regards, john
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WOW John life sure does get busy sometimes, i am also self employed running my own business it was winter time when there was no work coming in and i had spent all my money on the k0, thats when things started to get a bit grim, now work is coming in fast trouble is finding the time now.
i suppose you are very lucky in this life if you have time and money together,
pete
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haha well said pete ;D
time and money together! yeah matey it's one or the other for me too. yeah I starve half the year and buy bikes the other half. after a few cycles of that I have some sweet bikes, I will post some pics of my 83 silverwings some day. one has a hack. the other is factory mint (almost of course). I used to have quite a few "giant killers" ie rd350's but only have a couple left... kind of funny as the old early k's were the "giants" they killed. I should start a new thread... of course the cb750 would take the rd's on the open flats but put a big twisty road in the picture and the Race Developed 350 would win (nearly) every time. I love two strokes too much ;) anyways a lot of the old rd's got sold off, well I can't complain much as my kids get to spend the day with dad and a whole lot of bikes and a dirty warehouse with a dirty kitty cat and even more bikes... oh I have two older kids too (remarried) that I raised as a single parent, they are grown in fact I will soon be a grandpa, my oldest kid is a boy and of course rides, bought a new Harley this year after coming home from Afghanistan with the marine corps (a big hooray for all the sons/daughters/grandkids/parents who have served their country)... my oldest daughter is married and will soon keep the family young in the form of a new baby... anyways I do have some k0 parts and loads of k2 parts in the form of full bikes... matey we have lots in common so reach out if you need anything from this side of the pond... be happy to reship anything you need too, at true cost... lots of feebay sellers won't ship to UK just ship it to me and I will be happy to send along... that's an open offer... anyways I don't mean to hijack your fine post, you have inspired me and instead of working (it's so nice to not have a boss!) I spent the evening researching zinc plating and electrolysis as rust removal, totally inspired by your thread and your brilliant home zinc brew (I will have some future questions, mate!) keep up the good work, I have enjoyed your detailed pictures very much ;D cheers
nb, I have walked the four corners of the earth, in eastern Africa they say "salamu iwe juu yenu" which loosely translated means "may you always walk in peace" it sounds really lovely when spoken in Kiswahili especially to a kid who has never seen a white man walk amongst them, yet another story ;) have some nice traditional breakfast for me someday, gosh how I wish I could skip over there for a lovely traditional English breakfast, it's been years since I ate the real thing, next time I come to UK I will look you up, do the same if ever in the middle of USA matey... anyone who eats beans and tomatoes and eggs and fried bread in the morning is a good man to me :D just have to skip the tea and head over to Netherlands for some real coffee, the shit that makes my tongue feeling like it has hair growing on it haha... I am a caffeine fiend too mate :P
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Ok guys i have collected my paintwork and am very happy, the colour is perfect i had it matched using a NOS candy blue/green panel
Here is a complete photo collection of the work start to finish, notice he hand done the tank stripes at my request
the pictures were done on a camera phone and so are not perfect
First all parts degreased filled and keyed up ready for grey silver undercoat
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT3996.JPG)
next parts are given there first coat and at this stage any further inperfections are taken care of
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT3998.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT3999.JPG)
Here we have the parts all sprayed up in the candy blue green
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4058.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4054.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4051.JPG)
Tank going through masking and spraying of striping detail
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4060.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4061.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4062.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4063.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4065.JPG)
And finaly the finished set of paintwork
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4074.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4073.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4068.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4067.JPG)
I should also mention i had the painter do a spare set of fork ears, and my original airbox while he was doing all this
i am not sure wether to use original airbox or the repro one , here is the question what air box would you guys use original and risk it cracking or aftermarket?
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/PICT4069.JPG)
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wow is this helpful am i glad you spent the time to post this stuff. i am working on 786 an this is really a big help thanks
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here is the question what air box would you guys use original and risk it cracking or aftermarket?
;) don't chance it mate go with the repo. the original will fall to pieces with all the crap potholes here , you know its the right choice here a question back at you why do you have a blue neutral light in your clocks I have seen this before in fact it stopped me buying a clock of fleabay a few years ago but they keep turning up so they must be for real , so could it be for a particular market like japan or summit I presume yours is not a uk designated bike ::) cheers and get on wiv it, get it assembled and get riding this summer aint gonna last you know that ;) and yes nice work BTW
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Hi Steff, i suppose it makes sense to use the aftermatket box, however i will not ride this bike much as i have to many bikes and so only put a few miles on each, it might be worth using the original as it will only sit in a box and at least i can say it is another original part of the bike, which is keeping it true as i can to original
As for the blue jewel it is a camera thing just the same as when you try to photo candy blue green paint some how most cameras dont pick up the true colour, the jewels came from lecram and all his clock resto parts are spot on ,
It certainly wont be this year to get back on the road i am still juggling another 4 restorations and have just bought another project which is a ride and restore bike totally different to what i am used to here it is below it is called project BAD ASS LOL
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/IMAG0630.jpg)
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I have started gathering parts for the rebuild of my rear wheel, up until now i have not paid much attention to the rear wheel, it has sat there in the corner virtually untoched covered in grime, i was dissapointed to find that the final drive flange has been scuffed up by a chain incident in the past, this seems very common looking through some other peoples build threads, i have been thinking that perhaps my bike had a chain break in its first year as my engine number seems to have been stamped possibly by a dealer rather than honda, so it could have been rebuilt with new casings, or maybe not the date stamps in the engine cases are 1969 and consistant with the build date so who knows what has happened, anyway back to the wheel below is a picture of the scuffed up drive, i would say it is repairable , at the edge it still measures 3.5 mm so i think it could be sanded or machined out, what do you guys think
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/032.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/033%7E0.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/034.JPG)
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Chain incident or chain guard rubbing? (common) Here's a thread showing the damage to 576's flange.
http://cb750sandcastonly.com/smf_forum/index.php?topic=872.0 (http://cb750sandcastonly.com/smf_forum/index.php?topic=872.0)
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Yes i was looking back through other peoples posts on this matter earlier today when i see yours , i think mine is still salvageable, but yours looks past the point of return Wayne, did you manage to find a replacement ?
Pete
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Sure did Pete. Steve Swan came through for me. :)
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Pete,was looking thru the posts on your restoration thread.... Beautiful job !
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Thanks Steve, it has been slow moving of recent months but i am now starting to get enthusiastic again especially as i have a set of no number exhausts on order and the paint work all done, still leaves me with the engine to do, i might now use my original head, but am still searching for barrels, i have a k1 head and barrels which at a glance looks the same, but if you look up close at the front you can see a small difference where there is the extra front bolt,
Here are the pictures of my spare drive flange, from the outside this looks perfect, however it was damaged behind where the rubbers go two big chunks missing, so i got it welded up and i have roughly shaped it with a file, i dont think it will cause any issues if i use this now its repaired
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/019%7E1.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/024.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/030%7E1.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/028%7E0.JPG)
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Here is the welded Flange flatened off with various grades of wet and dry , then satin polished , just need to clear coat it now, i think that the satin polish finish topped with clear coat will be as near as i can get to original finish, i say this because this flange had part of its surface area where the clear coat was still on it, i removed this to reveal what i regard as a satin finish, the clear coat should gloss it up to be like a factory finish, however if it does not i will strip it back and polish it as i like the polished look as well, just means more maintenance
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/004%7E4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/002%7E3.JPG)
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Hi can any one tell me if my K0 should have the rear sprocket sheild as standard fitment.and also should i have the 45 tooth rear sprocket?
Thanks in advance pete
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45T rear sprocket was standard until the end of K0 production (according to parts lists), sprocket shield NOT fitted until into 1970 at VIN 1026845 or so.
Cheers - Chris R.
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Thanks Chris
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Hi all i am still gathering the parts for my rear wheel rebuild, i have what i think is a rolled rim which is correct for my bike but its in poor condition, my questions are firstly can someone confirm my rim is rolled, and second look at the rust pitting ,is it worth the money to get it restored then chromed, i was thinking of grinding down the two worst rust spots then build it up with weld and resurface those areas ready to be rechromed
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/118.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/114.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/120.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/119.JPG)
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is the bead perfectly round ? if so, correct for sandcast.
if the bead starts round then slightly flattens, rim's late "ko"/early k1.
no matter how good the pictures, these later rims are sometimes difficult to tell.
without actually seeing it, it looks like a later rim; bead appears to have a bit of a flat face.
the angle leading to the lateral face of the bead is less acute on these late "ko" rims, much less acute than the even later k1-onward rims which have a very obvious flat lateral face because the angle leading to the lateral face is even more acute and the lateral face is even more flat.
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Thanks for the reply steve, there must be at least 5 types of rim i have 4 different types, i have this one from an early69 k0, a nos one for a k1 with slightly less rounded with the DID logo, my F1 rear rim with the DID logo but distinctly flat, and then the later ones with the writing on the outside edge, so the sandcast ones make it 5
when you say perfectly rounded do you mean round from the the bit where the tyre seats right round to the flat of the rim?
pete
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when you say perfectly rounded do you mean round from the the bit where the tyre seats right round to the flat of the rim?pete
yes, round all the way around. no part of the bead is flat or even remotely appearing flat.
compare the subject of our discussion to your nos k1 rim. the beads may or may not be the same. likely not. later k1's had the even more flat faced bead than the early k1's/late ko's. and as you said, somewhere in the years, maybe as early as k2's the bead faces got really really flat. k5/6's for sure were very flat.
i know someone who stared hard at pictures of ko wheels on ebay on at least 2 separate occasions, gambling they were round bead...... upon sad receipt, hope was dashed. alas and alack. :)
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Thanks thats good info, i needed to know weather to restore it or not, i might as well use my NOS rim and save myself some money, now i best read up on how to build a wheel and start assembleing
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Whooooo hoooooo, i have finaly got myself a 1969 early K0 top end, i had to buy a complete 69 K0 engine to get it, the engine i bought is complete and has good compression it would not surprise me if it is a runner with a bit of work, be a shame to take it apart but i have searched for a 1969 top end for a year now, this is just what i need to get myself motivated on this build again, pictures to follow
pete
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Bet that is a December '69 motor ;D Pete ! Great that you found one.
Cheers.... AshD
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Yes you are right December 1969 , I stripped down the top end all seems good inside, it is always a gamble buying a 44 year old engine unseen but my gamble paid off
Pete
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]I have suddenly got the urge to resume my restoration so here goes, seeing as i have gathered all the front suspension parts i thought i would put them all together, as luck has it the bushing and piston were all within spec very little wear which is handy as you can't get the parts any more
its a great feeling when you have restored 44 year old parts , i just sat back and looked at it and thought 44 years ago someone in Japan was doing the same and assembling these very parts.
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/006%7E4.JPG)
my trusty assistant inspects the parts for quality
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/011%7E7.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/014%7E6.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/019%7E2.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/017%7E4.JPG[/img
[img]http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/021.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/021.JPG)
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They look awesome Pete!
What's is the next step in your project?
Best,
Duane
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Thanks Duane, my next move is to build up the wheels, i have most of the parts , the only thing i need is a front rim, my original is quite good but not worthy of this restoration unless i get it rechromed , over here in the UK chroming prices are extortionate, and very hard to get a decent job especially on wheels for some reason, i do have a NOS Honda front rim but it is the DID with the writing on the side, and that is not correct for the bike, while i am doing the wheels i need to find a decent welder to repair fin damage to my head then i can complete the engine rebuild, then all of a sudden things will come together alot faster (i hope)
pete
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Pete,
I need to have two places repaired on the top outside corner fins on my head, with one fin chipped partly off, I am looking for a source to make that happen before I assemble my current project's engine.
Are you having the fins built-up and ground down on your project?
Best,
Duane
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Hi Duane, i showed my head to a friend who used to weld for a living, he said the top fin had alot missing to build up and he would if doing the job cut a piece to shape and weld that in, on the second and third fin which had alot less damage he would build up with weld and reshape with a file
he no longer has access to a tig welder so i am now searching for someone to do the job
pete
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I was thinking the same thing, which is to cut an old fin replacement to shape and weld the top fin in place becuase of the access to the area.
Thanks for sharing.
Duane
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Hi Duane, i showed my head to a friend who used to weld for a living, he said the top fin had alot missing to build up and he would if doing the job cut a piece to shape and weld that in, on the second and third fin which had alot less damage he would build up with weld and reshape with a file
he no longer has access to a tig welder so i am now searching for someone to do the job
pete
Have a look at KP's comment in my thread here:
http://cb750sandcastonly.com/smf_forum/index.php?topic=335.45 (http://cb750sandcastonly.com/smf_forum/index.php?topic=335.45)
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Thanks for that Wayne, i shall bring this up with the welder when i eventually find one
pete
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Nice sunny weekend here in the UK, perfect day to strip and clean my carbs, took me two days but well worth the hard work, i spent about 3hrs on each carb cleaning with small tooth brushes, everthing has come up real well including all the zinc plated parts, i have loosely assembled them without the internals fitted as i will probably do some fine detailing work to them, probably strip and put a new zinc plating on some parts , the throttle stops have some corrosion so they will definetely be re-plated
Can anyone tell me the original finish to the float bowls, it appears to me they were polished and laquered, is that correct?, i have lightly polished them for now
pete
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/001%7E9.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/004%7E6.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/1969_K0_carbs_4.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/1969_K0_carbs_6.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/1969_K0_carbs_5.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/1969_K0_carbs_3.JPG)
(http://)
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Always nice to see parts brought back to life. Nice job
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Hi Pete, nice job.......what's the milky looking substance in the bowl?
Mick.........kettle738
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Hello Pete,
Two days of galley of cleaning certainly, but after what a pleasure to see the result!!
Very good job. ;)
Gerard
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Thanks for the compliments guys,
mick the milky looking substance is a strong mix of washing powder and water, after that treatment i soaked in thinners followed by a further scrub with the toothbrush, then a final wash off and blow through with airline
pete
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Nice work, I'm getting a lot of pointers for my own diecast restoration. Coming soon.
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Ok guys it was a shit rainy mid day here i have no money to spend but have some time on my hands so went about reshaping my ducktail seat, first picture is when i first put the seat together a while back, the rest are todays attempts, after numerous cover removals and carefully removing the foam at about 8mm a time, i took off over an inch in all , the seat is loosely assembled as in i have not attached the side trim or bent the tab hooks over at the back or cleaned it for that matter and the pictures do not really do it justice as in the flesh i think it looks fantastic i am chuffed to bits
what you fellas recon?
old picture
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/111.JPG)
new pictures
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/039.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/037.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/042.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/033~1.JPG)
(http://cb750sandcastonly.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10004/036.JPG)
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Hi Pete, cracking job on your seat, that profile looks spot on to me. I do wonder though if the European bikes had different seat profiles to the US bikes as those I've seen on the site (particularly the unrestored bikes) seem to match the Yamiya seat which is not really like the sculptured seat you have made.
The first two pics are the seat that came on 1010369 when I bought it.....looks exactly like yours doesn't it? I have since substituted that seat with a better European sourced one which is exactly the same again, but look at the last pic of the Yamiya red foam seat and it's quite different.
You should be proud of that.......great job.
Mick.........kettle738
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Pete nice job on reworking the seat, time and patience is the key. Marty K.
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Thanks you marty and mick for the compliments,i was really pleased with the outcome considering how puffy it looked the first time i did it, i have the seat sitting in my conservatory and i sit out there and admire it, there is something about a ducktail seat, that just makes it easy on the eye,
pete
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I know this thread is 4 + years old, but I enjoyed reading through it.
How did the bike turn out did you finish it UKPete? would love to see some completed pictures of it.
I have a 12/69 manufacturer date K0 I am slowly working on, it was a major basket case, just frame and engine pretty much.
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We haven’t seen Pete in some time Brian. Not sure where he disappeared to. Hopefully we get to see the end result of your hard work and dedication.
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Hi, i still have the project, not much really happening to it, i cant carry on the restoration thread on here as i am locked out of the coppermine image hosting site, and it appears to be no way back in to it
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Thanks for the thread, I enjoyed it and am always on the lookout for new to me information. I've had some luck with google photos and moving them using a thread on the sohc4.net open forum stickies.
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What a great read. Thanks for taking the time to take the photos and post it all up. Cheers, TC.
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Hi, i still have the project, not much really happening to it, i cant carry on the restoration thread on here as i am locked out of the coppermine image hosting site, and it appears to be no way back in to it
Pete. I’ve checked your profile on coppermine. All seemed fine. Others are able to log in. I’ve sent you a private message with your login and password change.
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Thanks for the thread, I enjoyed it and am always on the lookout for new to me information. I've had some luck with google photos and moving them using a thread on the sohc4.net open forum stickies.
Don. The reason I set up the coppermine gallery for restoration threads or members who want to post a lot of images is we don’t want to lose that valuable information. When images are hosted remotely often what happens is users will close the image account or delete photos and we wind up with a big blank image in our threads. Keeping images on our servers mitigates that risk.
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I hear that, photobucket has trashed several of my threads and other reference photos on other subjects. I paid their ransom for a month to transfer my photos to Google. I really appreciate the ability to refer to the pictures and text here.
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What are the original tire size for the CB750 K0 1970?
And which tire brand and size would you recommend putting on?
Do they use the same tire dimension in Europe and the US?
Bruce
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Hi!
Front 3,25 -19 Rib tire. Air pressure 2.0kg
Rear 4.00-18 Block tire. Air pressure 2,0kg
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I bought a pretty nice K0 that's mostly there, what it needed I have left from other bikes and saving things. Anyway the seat needed recovering and I checked here to refresh my memory. I've been saving a cover but when I rolled it over I found a crack almost all of the way across the pan. A guy on SOHC4 sold me a pretty nice seat from a "pan wanted" ad but I don't think I'll take it apart, it's pretty nice in the pics and my diecast has a cheaper repro seat on it.
So here I am still needing a seat pan. I'm hoping to snag a K1 seat with a good pan after payday. (Just bought a bunch of car parts) In the meantime I may try to tig the cracked pan and reinforce it from the top side.
I also notice there aren't any new 4-4 exhausts available. Not sure if they just sold out or the factories and shipping are shut down due to the pandemic.