Here we go! Restoring 576/748

[Wayne]

Almost forgotthe petcock! Mine is a short so I want to restore it. It has grime, primer and paint in areas. It's a mess. Are these refinished any particular way or just say, soda blasted clean and reassembled. I'll add the screws into my zic batch. (if i ever get there!)

[Wayne]

Just an update on my trip to M&M Plating for my Zinc. After looking at samples of the zinc nickel I have decided to go with just clear zinc and gold zinc. Although the zinc nickel is more robust it has a shiny and more yellow appearance as you would expect with nickel plating. 200.00 cash for my clear and gold zinc pieces. That's all the parts including spokes and nipples. I might sell the spokes and purchase stainless. Haven't decided there yet.

[Steve Swan]

Wayne, $200 for "everything" is in the same ballpark as Specialty Plating, in Denver, charges me for "everything."  Right on!

[vnz00]

Hi Steve n Wayne,
Just wanted to ask if you guys both wire wheel the parts to clean them before plating? Or fo you just leave it to the platers to acid bath the parts? Also, do u coat them to protect the zinc from tarnishing?

Thanks,
Steven.

[Wayne]

Steven
I cleaned a lot of the parts myself with CLR just to see the condition after zinc and corrosion was removed. The plater will use an acid bath to remove everything. He explained to me that all "stressed" parts like springs, spokes etc. will be put though a process after stripping so they are not brittle and will function as designed.

I really struggled with whether or not to go with the Zinc Nickel as it would do just as you described, protect the part for MUCH longer than just clear zinc. After looking at it though, because of sheen and colour I decided to go with zinc alone. The business owner concurred with my decision. He said If we are concerned about zinc discoloration, just put a thin coat of light oil on the fastener while in storage, after cleaning etc.

By the way, Jerry at M&m was great! gave me a tour of the place, showed me all of the process's they use. Pretty big operation. I was surprised!

[Steve Swan]

I run every part to be zinc'd over the wire wheel.  Since our ave.relative humidity is around 25%, we don't worry so much about degradation of zinc finishes, at least for the short term.  4363 restoration was finished 2002, it still looks fresh.  Like Wayne, in 2001, i did a tour of Specialty Plating (zinc) in Denver, they also put stressed parts through a process so they are not brittle.

[hondasan]

Prior to re-zinc, I always de-grease and then glass bead blast (we have a cabinet at work with "tumble basket"). Then take them straight to the plater for BZP which I understand is zinc with a clear passivate, Amazing how good the parts are that are returned. The last "whole bikes worth" (except spokes) of re-zinc I had done cost £25 ($40) through the back door of a commercial plater here in the UK.

The risk with the process is that during electroplating, hydrogen is generated and diffuses into the surface of the parts. Highly strength stressed items such as springs, spokes, spring washers, bolts, are all susceptible to hydrogen embrittlement, and can fail when re -used (all are stressed in tension when re-used). The failure usually occurs within a short time of re-use, but can wait a while before showing!
The risk can be eliminated with a "de-embrittlement" treatment (as Wayne's plater mentioned), which is basically a low heat soak for quite a number of hours - I forget the recommended conditions; the metallurgists at work will know.
Springs ESPECIALLY are at risk, hence I always use NOS mainstand / sidestand springs during a re-build, and also spokes as failures of these could be particularly painful on a bike which is to be ridden. I have had a number of spring washer failures over the years, but of course they are only security measures on bolts anyway.

Cheers - Chris R.

[Steve Swan]

I emailed Sue at Specialty Plating, to refresh my memory.  They bake the parts at 350' for 3hrs to remove the brittleness.

[Wayne]

Well, got my zinc parts back today. For the most part they look great! I'm quite pleased. There are pieces that don't look so good, that being the larger parts like the brake anchor, hangar bolts and the arm for the axle wrench. If you look carefully at the pic's you will see these items look more like gray paint over spray than the more shiny zinc coating on the rest of the pieces. I'm not sure what to do with them at this point. I guess I may have to re-do them or if someone has a home system that can do a few parts for me perhaps that is another option.

[Wayne]

Well, it's cold, my Harley is now in storage and my frame and related parts are back from my painter. I must say, having the zinc parts and painted parts back have me more than a bit pumped! PPG Concept #9300 Polyurethane paint is not available in Canada due to VOC regulations so my painter used House of Kolors Paint. (he's a regional rep) He seemed pretty well versed on how these frames were supposed to look so I let him go for it. Here is the end result. To me, it looks good. The pictures may change the gloss appearance to some degree. He told me the product he used is very durable and should hold up very well. Now if I can just get my hands on some DE1612 Engine Primer so I can get my engine together! Can't buy that in Canada either! Got the DE1615 Paint at the local Auto Store but not the primer. Sometimes living in the frozen North is frustrating.

[Riccardo]

Well, got my zinc parts back today. For the most part they look great! I'm quite pleased. There are pieces that don't look so good, that being the larger parts like the brake anchor, hangar bolts and the arm for the axle wrench. If you look carefully at the pic's you will see these items look more like gray paint over spray than the more shiny zinc coating on the rest of the pieces. I'm not sure what to do with them at this point. I guess I may have to re-do them or if someone has a home system that can do a few parts for me perhaps that is another option.

mmmmmmmmm....jewellery

[Wayne]

Well I got tired of trying to get my hands on some DuliColor DE1612 Engine Primer here in Canada so as per the company I went with their CSP-100 High Temp Primer. It's a bit darker than the DE1615 Paint so hopefully I won't get any chips or nicks during assembly.  

Pretty straight forward but as MarkB said, this part of the job is very time consuming if you want the paint to stay on. A painter once told me, It's not the paint, it's all in the prep! I still think the paint has a bit to do with it!  

So after de-greasing the cases we had to get the old paint and other impurities cleaned off. I didn't trust sending my prefect "748" cases out so I chose to do them myself. My weapon of choice, the Speed Blaster hand held sand blaster. This product worked amazingly well off my small 10 gal home compressor! I'm impressed and wish I had bought one long ago! I bought some very fine aggregate from my local Napa Store and Bob's your Uncle! They cleaned up great and with little or no "cutting away" as they call it, of the substrate material.



So here's a shot of the upper case (nice VIN!   ) all blasted, blown out with compressed air, high pressure washer, rinsed in dish soap and water, clean water rinse, and blown out with compressed air again to ensure all sand is out! I'm a bit paranoid when sandblasting engine components.



Finally after a lot more prep taping off the cases and giving a final wipe with some Acetone we have the  painted cases. 2 coats of Duli-Color CSP-100 primer and 2 coats of DupliColor DE1615 Paint. After 3 hours drying time in the oven it goes at 200 degrees or so. Good thing my wife is at work!   Now, onto the lower case!

[Steve Swan]

Bee-u-tee-ful !

[Wayne]

Thanks Steve. I finally feel like I'm getting somewhere. After buying and prepping so many pieces, getting the black parts painted, and soon the engine cases we should be engine building before long.  I forgot I had to order some M8 Form B Washers so I got those ordered today. Have lots of new M6's so we will be in good shape to put the bottom end and cases together when they arrive. I decided to go with stainless washers. The dimensions are exact to the original zinc Form B washers. Again, thanks to MarkB for the tip on those.

Funny how you start to go over stuff in your head at this point. Are the black parts the correct gloss, am I missing parts to proceed with this part of the build,  etc. etc. I guess you find out as you go! 

[markb]

That's significant progress Wayne.  It's fun to see you making some headway.