Finish on Pipe B, Front Brake - Pt. #45128-3000-010

[markb]

Does anyone know the correct finish on the subject part?  New replacements are black and I haven't been able to locate an original looking one.  What is the black finish?  Can it be stripped and replated?  Worst case I would try to replate a used original.
Mark

[4pots1969]

Hi Mark,
Here is a pictures of the first early models Pipe B Front Brake - 45128-300-010 black clamping sleeves.

[markb]

Thanks, I didn't realize the nuts were black.  What I was referring to was the pipe itself was black on the new replacements.

[hondasan]

Pretty sure the original factory fitment had bzp nuts and pipe. That replacement with black passivate nuts, even though in an older type parts bag, must be another variant?

Chris

[markb]

I checked my pipes and most of them are in rough condition but none of them had any hint of black finish on either the tubing or the nuts.  Since my first post I luckily just scored on an unused part that has been sitting around for a while.  It doesn't look perfect, no rust but a little tarnish, and I think it will clean up great.  It also does not have black nuts.  I don't believe my bikes were fitted with pipes with black nuts but obviously at some point at least some of them were made that way.

[kp]

I've never seen a black finish on any K0 brake nut or the pipe and don't beleive that this is original finish. I've a number of ORIGINAL brake calliper complete with pipe "on and off early bikes" and none have a black nut. This is a "ring in" part IMHO
I agree with Chris R in that for me the bag (and tag - my words) means little. A replacement part is not an originally fitted part rather a replacement part and Honda were using these parts bags and labels into the 90's. We need to be clear that a replacement part in a bag does not in itself signify or prove a part is original fitment and whilst it is a guide to us all we must be mindful that such is not an absolute.
Please don't shoot me as I am merely expressing my opinion and sound logic on this point.

[Steve Swan]

from what i've seen, always thought bzp on pipe and fittings.  later production oem parts could be different from original production fitted on assembly line.

[4pots1969]

bzp?

[4pots1969]

I've never seen a black finish on any K0 brake nut or the pipe and don't beleive that this is original finish. I've a number of ORIGINAL brake calliper complete with pipe "on and off early bikes" and none have a black nut. This is a "ring in" part IMHO
I agree with Chris R in that for me the bag (and tag - my words) means little. A replacement part is not an originally fitted part rather a replacement part and Honda were using these parts bags and labels into the 90's. We need to be clear that a replacement part in a bag does not in itself signify or prove a part is original fitment and whilst it is a guide to us all we must be mindful that such is not an absolute.
Please don't shoot me as I am merely expressing my opinion and sound logic on this point.

KP, you mean that replacement OEM Honda parts were not necessarily parts used on assembly lines at the Honda factory for the period Sandcast?
This is a "ring in" part IMHO: what does it mean?
Gerard

[markb]

KP, you mean that replacement OEM Honda parts were not necessarily parts used on assembly lines at the Honda factory for the period Sandcast?

I think that's what KP is saying (sorry, I shouldn't be speaking for you) but here is another example.  If you buy the bands for the insulators from the carbs to the head, they are now black and it is the same Honda part number.  So just because it's the correct part number doesn't mean it's "correct" for the sandcast period.

BZP = bright zinc plate

Yes, what is a "ring in" part?

[kp]

Ha Ha Ring in is Ozzie slang for "not the real thing". A bit like repop parts. A Honda part it may be but it is not like the original part so I've used the expression "ring in" or its a changed item 

[kp]

I know this is an old thread but I have recently been looking at my and other metal disc brake lines that causes me to open this discussion again. I had 6 of these lines and was getting them cleaned and sorted to go to the zinc plater. The problem (or no problem) with these lines is that after years of use they can become rusty and/or the flare nuts become very burred. Of the 6; I'm left with 3 that have relatively good nuts and no pitting or rust. As Mark pointed out the new replacement lines are black and getting non-black NOS pipes is almost impossible.
Anyway the reason I am resurrecting this thread is because my good friend Rob has a NOS pipe in a bag and I asked to use this as a guide to making sure the bends in my used pipes are the same. Well I'm looking at Rob's very old NOS pipe, and as stated previously (with photo) by Gerard, the same black nuts were on this pipe and there was something else. To my mind this pipe in a sealed bag is not zinc plated. Nope! It's just not zinc looking. I check the original pipes on my bikes and the one on 28 doesn't show the black passivated nuts. This pipe is, as far as I understand, original to the bike and the only intervention by me was to ultrasonically clean it and re-install without doing anything else. It is left in the original rust free finish. My second bike has a rusty pipe but the nuts seem to have residual zinc plate still evident. I also believe this pipe is original to the bike. Both seem to have no black passivated flare nuts.
Of the 3 pipes I intended to get zinc plated, 2 have zinc flare nuts and the other has black passivated. All these brake lines came from Tokyo1 assemblies. Now previously I said I'd never seen a black flare nut on one of these lines and I hadn't until now. I must have just plain and simply missed that detail, as these lines came off existing brake assemblies I have.
My next post is the interesting one.

[kp]

I've recently found a zinc plater not far from me who only does special zinc work, mainly for the restoration and the show car/bike fraternity. He can do nuts and bolts but charges by the individual piece so I have most of my items drum plated cos it's way way cheaper although all his hand wired works superb. Anyway this fellows spent 35 years in the industry and there isn't much he doesn't know about plating. I spoke to him about these brake lines and what he told me was very interesting indeed. He states that most brake line, especially decade old pipe, could be lead coated or tinned. Copper line could be lead covered whereas he said steel line was mostly tinned as zinc plating coils of steel tubing was just not done. His belief is these lines are tinned, with zinc plated flare nuts fitted during brake line manufacture.
Further comments, thoughts or discussion is welcomed