Build dates

[kmb69]

What is the earliest build date known for a complete bike as well as individual parts?

[kmb69]

I guess I must have bad breath or BO? No answers?
Is the answer already on the website or forum and I can't find it?

[Steve Swan]

What is the earliest build date known for a complete bike as well as individual parts?

Keith, that is a good question, i don't know that this question has been asked before... 

when you say "build date known for a complete bike" what identifier(s) would you look for?  as far as we know, the vin tags on RH steering head did not begin until August '69, so as to a build date for a complete bike that came off the assembly line other than a vin tag, i do not know nor have i heard there is a way to determine a build date for the motorcycle.

in the case of identifying exact dates, the only thing i would know to do is to start looking for date stampings.  the earlier crankcases did not have sates on them like later cases.  if i recall correctly, the waffle cam cover i had, had an ink stamp of 4.3.44, so to my way of thinking this date would be March 4, 1969...  keener minds than mine  can correct me if i am wrong as i have turned my will and my life over to the madness of the 1927 Harley-Davidson world.  (Building a second one.)

[hondasan]

In the back of my mind, I recall a feature in a Norwegian / Swedish magazine showing a picture supposedly of number 1 with the date 15th March 1969. Maybe someone else has seen the same (Bo, ??).

Chris R.

[kmb69]

.....
when you say "build date known for a complete bike" what identifier(s) would you look for?  as far as we know, the vin tags on RH steering head did not begin until August '69, so as to a build date for a complete bike that came off the assembly line other than a vin tag, i do not know nor have i heard there is a way to determine a build date for the motorcycle.

in the case of identifying exact dates, the only thing i would know to do is to start looking for date stampings.  the earlier crankcases did not have sates on them like later cases.  if i recall correctly, the waffle cam cover i had, had an ink stamp of 4.3.44, so to my way of thinking this date would be March 4, 1969...  keener minds than mine  can correct me if i am wrong as i have turned my will and my life over to the madness of the 1927 Harley-Davidson world.  (Building a second one.)

I know the tags were "blank" early on. And the part "stampings" might be the best indicator.
Good luck with the HD.

In the back of my mind, I recall a feature in a Norwegian / Swedish magazine showing a picture supposedly of number 1 with the date 15th March 1969. Maybe someone else has seen the same (Bo, ??).

Chris R.

That's kind of what I was looking for. Was hoping someone knew when the first production bike rolled out.

[Steve Swan]

In the back of my mind, I recall a feature in a Norwegian / Swedish magazine showing a picture supposedly of number 1 with the date 15th March 1969. Maybe someone else has seen the same (Bo, ??).

Chris R.

Chris, i seem to remember that mag you are referring to; pretty sure i have it in my literature collection.

Keith, i think back in the day we were talking about vin ranges in respect to production run dates.  i seem to recall KP or someone or maybe it was a group of us hypothesizing vin ranges/production run dates in an attempt to create some sort of time frame as to when vin ranges began.

we also have that famous picture of all the engineers standing behind #1 with snow on the ground; if i recall correctly i believe Bob Jameson verifying at the 2009, 40th Anniversary Meeting that that picture is authentic to machine, men and date.

[kp]

Yes, we were shooting the breeze about this very subject Mr Swan. I have no idea when production actually commenced but I have my thoughts. That photo and date IMHO was simply a press event which may have had little bearing on actual production commencement. I'm thinking they took good old #1 (and 2 and 3) and stripped it bare to make the workshop manual and other such things. I would also be thinking that getting production under way would have required training, component manufacture and the like, production parts stockpiling and phase planning. The other matter relates to the date codes we are finding on very early parts. April for early stuff with the few odd parts date coded March. The earliest recorded engine casting date is very early April from around E320 and by the end of April we are at E970 so I'm thinking engine casting started maybe the last week in March as the earliest. They've cast around 600 or 700 cases in maybe 25 days or around 20 to 25 per day so they wouldn't have had any complete engines by April 1 at least. We also know from Steven, his waffle cover is dated latish April and only about 250 engines had these covers.
The other interesting dates are the sale dates of the early bikes. Late June and early July seems to be the earliest sale dates cropping up.
Taking all this into account I reckon May 1 is probably a date I'd go with. This allows production, packing and shipping to the US ready for market and selling. Surely Honda must know this information

[kmb69]

Thanks Steve, Chris, and KP.
The attached is the only Honda press release I could find. It was in Japanese and I used the Google translator.
It was dated July, 1969 but they claim to begin exporting April, 1969.

[markb]

I have no record of this but I thought that production ran from June to September 1969. Am I mistaken?

[42barab]

Thanks Steve, Chris, and KP.
The attached is the only Honda press release I could find. It was in Japanese and I used the Google translator.
It was dated July, 1969 but they claim to begin exporting April, 1969.

.    I wonder just how much combined printed information the members of this forum must have.  Thanks for sharing.

John

[kp]

I'd say between Steve, Chris and Keith to name 3, then they would probably have most.

[Steve Swan]

I'd say between Steve, Chris and Keith to name 3, then they would probably have most.

i have a Swedish mag from a few years back that interviewed Bob Jameson that if i remember correctly discusses when and how #1 was put together and the early days of production.  i'll have to dig it out.

[hondasan]

Would be great to see that - and get a translation.....

Chris R.

[Steve Swan]

Would be great to see that - and get a translation.....

Chris R.

Chris, i now believe it is actually Norwegian.  Bo is a Swede (i am 76% Swedish!), perhaps he knows someone who has the mag and who can translate...  the 10 page all color article is the interview with Bob Jameson, shows a pic of him and Bob Young together and shows a pic of the infamous March 15, 1969 production picture of #1 and in the caption mentions Bob Jameson.  the article's focus appears exclusive to the pre-production period of the CB750 and has 11 excellent pics taken during the pre-production era.

[bojje]

Hi!
Interesting discussion. Just that swedish magasine will have an article about sandcasts with photos of my bikes in next magasine as 50 year anniversary. They have also made a reprint of the article you are asking for. I will check later today what I can find and hopfully be able to confirm, what I thought we all had as productionstart, 15 of March 1969.
Bo